This is an interview with Nick Barlow, founder of the ‘Liberal Democrats for Basic Income’ group, you can read an article about the group here.
BINews: What stage is the Basic Income Liberal Democrat group at now and where do you see it going in the next 5 or so years?
Nick Barlow: We’re still very much at the coming together stage (top tip: don’t try organising a new group just before the Christmas break) and about getting the idea out there and discussed.(see this article for instance). There’s no formal structure to the group yet beyond an email list and a Facebook group, but people are joining up.
Realistically, I think the key time for basic income supporters in the party is going to be after the general election, when I think people will be looking at how we move forward and develop the party in the coming years. I would hope that in some point within the next couple of years we’d be able to take a proposal to party conference to be debated.
BINews: What makes you think the Liberal Democrats are particularly suited to adopt the policy of Basic Income?
Nick: First, because it was party policy before between 1990 and 94, and it was also suggested and discussed (usually alongside Land Value Tax) in the old Liberal Party.
I think there’s a need for a liberalism in the twenty-first century that understands a lot more has to be done to ensure positive liberty. For me, a basic income is a way of ensuring that basic level of provision for everyone which enables them to be free and to give them power. If we are serious about freeing people from poverty, ignorance and conformity – the party’s purpose, according to its constitution – then a basic income is one of the best ways of doing that.
BINews: What steps do you think are necessary for the idea to gain traction within the party and eventually be adopted?
Nick: First, I think we need to build awareness and challenge some of the preconceptions against basic income. A lot of people (in the party and society as a whole) just aren’t aware of the idea, so there’s work to be done in making people realise it is possible. In a wider sense, I think there needs to be a wider discussion about the future of the party and how people see liberalism. Basic income is just one idea that the party could adopt if it wants to be different, but we first have to answer the question of whether we strike out and be different, or just go for a centrist position.
BINews: Do you envisage it being adopted by the party within the next 10-15 years?
Nick: I think it’s entirely possible it could be adopted by the party within five years, if the party is willing to try a new direction.
BINews: What impact do you think the adoption of Basic Income would have on support for the party?
Nick: It’s very hard to say, because there’d obviously be a lot of negative publicity from the mainstream press, especially given the current coverage of anything to do with benefits, but it would open up a lot of potential new support (and reclaimed old support) who are people interested in doing things differently, As a key idea to show how we’re different from the big two parties, it would stand out, but the party would have to be willing to take the flak that comes with it in order to stand out.
If you look back at the party’s manifesto in 1992, basic income (Citizen’s Income as it was branded then) wasn’t just one policy, it was part of a wide-ranging set of policies that would have reshaped the whole relationship between the individual and the state. It was that commitment to doing things differently that I think helped rally the party from the low points of the late 80s and helped it recover.
BINews: Do you see the idea of Basic Income becoming a mainstream idea in British politics in the near future?
Nick: I think it’s unlikely in the short term, just because of the sheer level of demonisation the very concept of benefits is receiving at the moment. I think to get more widespread acceptance of basic income needs not just that to change, but for people to be more aware of how the way the economy works has changed. I’ve written before about the concept of ‘workism’, and how we fetishise the idea of people having to work, and that’s deeply rooted in our culture.
Basic income isn’t just a small adjustment to the system, it’s about a much more fundamental change than other policies, and to make it mainstream means a whole lot of wider attitudes need to change. To get back to the point, one of the reasons for looking to start a Liberal Democrats for Basic Income group was to help promote the debates and discussions we need to have, and keep having, to get the idea more widespread attention. Shifting widely-held attitudes takes a long time and a lot of conversations.
